Update on 3.2ltr 16v turbo race car.
Ha, well we'll see about that. I'd be happy enough to be a passenger. I haven't driven anything fast for some time now. Certainly nothing like your car will be!Thom wrote: Sat Jul 06, 2024 3:35 pm Understood. Looking forward to meeting up in October and letting you drive my car.
Thanks Rob. We were pretty close to firing it back up but when I found out that we weren't going to make it to this year's event I decided to put it on the backburner and save some money for now. Frustrating as I'm still a little nervous about the new MiD setup. Now I don't believe we will get it back to the dyno until next year.ROB III wrote: Thu Jul 11, 2024 6:03 pm Patrick, your dedication over the years is inspiring and that engine is beautiful!
Just looking at the date of the last entry in this thread. Where does the time go...
As for my car, well many of you know after the debacle in 2017 I just parked it for a number of years. Eventually raising some funds my emotions got the better of me and I decided to rebuild it, enter in WTAC '24 and then sell it. But of course things dragged out, people delayed us so we thought 2025 for sure. It took a long while to find someone to make the aero at a reasonable cost but even that didn't work out. More on that later. As for the motor, when I sent it up to have the MiD sleeves installed I was told there were a few other issues with it and paid to take care of them. One of them being 'relieving the rods' to be properly piston guided. I'd never even heard of that term but apparently that was required. Not that it was expensive but I don't know if that was the intention of the US motor or not? To my knowledge it was never mentioned. Also apparently there were problems with the valves not sealing properly which was surprising. Nevertheless all these things were taken care of and it was shipped back to us in Sydney.
So we thought we had plenty of time to get it all up and running and shakedowns done. Unfortunately the wiring guy/engineer kept promising to come and work on the car but kept delaying and stalling. I could feel that this was going to be a repeat of previous years where all of a sudden you're racing to get things finished in time just to make the event. The fire and the retardant really caused a lot of problems and took up a lot of my budget to just get back to level terms. When the engineer finally fronted up he seemed disinterested and somewhat surely. This could have all been circumvented if he had just said 6 months earlier, "I don't want to work on the car any more". We could have found someone else in plenty of time. He gave us a list of things to do including a lot of replacing sensors which could have been affected by the retardant. There was one sensor he didn't advise to replace but more on that later. Finally it was time to start the motor in the shop prior to the dyno. It was now literally days before the event. So that meant no time to shake the car down. Incredibly frustrating yet again. But the motor fired up and according to the engineer, he saw a voltage movement to show that there was oil pressure. Obviously it was only idling.
Finally off to the dyno. Of course we had more issues. There was a lot of gunk in the fuel system due to the E85. Everything was cleaned or replaced. Pumps, injectors etc. Initially It made about 480whp at 13psi on a basic tune. However of course the clutch started slipping when he tried to load in more boost. They tried adjusting things but really couldn't get it to hold anything more than 13psi. This pretty much meant no event. While doing this the operator heard some knocking sounds. Shut it down. Found metal in the filter. That was that. Turns out that the oil pressure read on the Motec dash wasn't calibrated correctly and it was about 3x less than the actual pressure! After tearing the motor down and sending the crank / rods up to the machinist who sleeved the block they tested the crank and found it had a crack in it. Plus one of the rods was bent. Clearly this was a punch in the guts....yet again...The engineer who had stalled us by months caused us so much pain. When he finally came and suggested changing out a ton of things he didn't say to replace the oil pressure sensor. When the car was back at the workshop Paul decided to turn the motor over with a drill after attaching a mechanical gauge on the line. It showed that on the dash/ECU the oil pressure was reading 3x what the actual pressure was. I don't know why we had a drop in oil pressure but had we had the correct calibration then we could have adjusted the d/sump pump. I don't even know if an oil pressure sensor can 'half work' ? I'd have thought either yes or no? When I went back to the engineer he just calmly said "It should have had a mech gauge on there" Why he didn't insist upon this when they fired up the engine for the first time in the shop pre dyno I don't know? But as usual, no responsibility is taken by anyone and I'm left holding my wallet open again. I now need a new crank and rods which is not a deal breaker, but I don't want to go back to a stroker crank nor do I really want to use a stock 30 year old crank either. So I'll probably have to fork out for a brand new one from the factory ($5700!) and get some rods to suit a 3ltr rather than 3.2ltr. Having said all that, by the time I pay for that and another engine assembly it's probably $15k all up. Then we get to the Aero. So years ago the Aerodynamicist came and scanned the car for the 2nd time. Unbeknown to me, he scanned it with the old box rocker panels on there. I don't know why he didn't get them taken off? Unfortunately I didn't realise this until the c/f guy came down to Sydney (where I paid for his hotel accommodation for a week) for us to find that not only were the rockers too long and would have to be taken back to his shop in QLD, but they were never going to fit due to the incorrect design. I guess that's the problem with getting body parts made without the car being in his shop. The C/F guy was just going off the CAD that was supplied. Over the course of this latest aero package trying get A.G. (Aero guy) to communicate with C/F (carbon fibre guy) has never been easy. I have to say a feeling of being cursed does occur. Hence I am considering selling the car as is and just getting it out of my life. Would take a HUGE financial loss but I've already spent more than I'll gain by selling it whole. Having to probably spend another $25k+ makes no sense except for the emotional side of seeing it completed. Anyway, that's it in a nutshell.
If I decide to continue with the car many would advise trying to ascertain the cause of the oil pressure loss and ensuing failure before undertaking yet another build. This makes total sense yet causes me more headaches trying to get this done. So if anyone wants to purchase an incomplete racecar that has a ton of great parts feel free to contact me. I know RHD isn't ideal in most of the Northern Hemisphere but it is what it is.
As for my car, well many of you know after the debacle in 2017 I just parked it for a number of years. Eventually raising some funds my emotions got the better of me and I decided to rebuild it, enter in WTAC '24 and then sell it. But of course things dragged out, people delayed us so we thought 2025 for sure. It took a long while to find someone to make the aero at a reasonable cost but even that didn't work out. More on that later. As for the motor, when I sent it up to have the MiD sleeves installed I was told there were a few other issues with it and paid to take care of them. One of them being 'relieving the rods' to be properly piston guided. I'd never even heard of that term but apparently that was required. Not that it was expensive but I don't know if that was the intention of the US motor or not? To my knowledge it was never mentioned. Also apparently there were problems with the valves not sealing properly which was surprising. Nevertheless all these things were taken care of and it was shipped back to us in Sydney.
So we thought we had plenty of time to get it all up and running and shakedowns done. Unfortunately the wiring guy/engineer kept promising to come and work on the car but kept delaying and stalling. I could feel that this was going to be a repeat of previous years where all of a sudden you're racing to get things finished in time just to make the event. The fire and the retardant really caused a lot of problems and took up a lot of my budget to just get back to level terms. When the engineer finally fronted up he seemed disinterested and somewhat surely. This could have all been circumvented if he had just said 6 months earlier, "I don't want to work on the car any more". We could have found someone else in plenty of time. He gave us a list of things to do including a lot of replacing sensors which could have been affected by the retardant. There was one sensor he didn't advise to replace but more on that later. Finally it was time to start the motor in the shop prior to the dyno. It was now literally days before the event. So that meant no time to shake the car down. Incredibly frustrating yet again. But the motor fired up and according to the engineer, he saw a voltage movement to show that there was oil pressure. Obviously it was only idling.
Finally off to the dyno. Of course we had more issues. There was a lot of gunk in the fuel system due to the E85. Everything was cleaned or replaced. Pumps, injectors etc. Initially It made about 480whp at 13psi on a basic tune. However of course the clutch started slipping when he tried to load in more boost. They tried adjusting things but really couldn't get it to hold anything more than 13psi. This pretty much meant no event. While doing this the operator heard some knocking sounds. Shut it down. Found metal in the filter. That was that. Turns out that the oil pressure read on the Motec dash wasn't calibrated correctly and it was about 3x less than the actual pressure! After tearing the motor down and sending the crank / rods up to the machinist who sleeved the block they tested the crank and found it had a crack in it. Plus one of the rods was bent. Clearly this was a punch in the guts....yet again...The engineer who had stalled us by months caused us so much pain. When he finally came and suggested changing out a ton of things he didn't say to replace the oil pressure sensor. When the car was back at the workshop Paul decided to turn the motor over with a drill after attaching a mechanical gauge on the line. It showed that on the dash/ECU the oil pressure was reading 3x what the actual pressure was. I don't know why we had a drop in oil pressure but had we had the correct calibration then we could have adjusted the d/sump pump. I don't even know if an oil pressure sensor can 'half work' ? I'd have thought either yes or no? When I went back to the engineer he just calmly said "It should have had a mech gauge on there" Why he didn't insist upon this when they fired up the engine for the first time in the shop pre dyno I don't know? But as usual, no responsibility is taken by anyone and I'm left holding my wallet open again. I now need a new crank and rods which is not a deal breaker, but I don't want to go back to a stroker crank nor do I really want to use a stock 30 year old crank either. So I'll probably have to fork out for a brand new one from the factory ($5700!) and get some rods to suit a 3ltr rather than 3.2ltr. Having said all that, by the time I pay for that and another engine assembly it's probably $15k all up. Then we get to the Aero. So years ago the Aerodynamicist came and scanned the car for the 2nd time. Unbeknown to me, he scanned it with the old box rocker panels on there. I don't know why he didn't get them taken off? Unfortunately I didn't realise this until the c/f guy came down to Sydney (where I paid for his hotel accommodation for a week) for us to find that not only were the rockers too long and would have to be taken back to his shop in QLD, but they were never going to fit due to the incorrect design. I guess that's the problem with getting body parts made without the car being in his shop. The C/F guy was just going off the CAD that was supplied. Over the course of this latest aero package trying get A.G. (Aero guy) to communicate with C/F (carbon fibre guy) has never been easy. I have to say a feeling of being cursed does occur. Hence I am considering selling the car as is and just getting it out of my life. Would take a HUGE financial loss but I've already spent more than I'll gain by selling it whole. Having to probably spend another $25k+ makes no sense except for the emotional side of seeing it completed. Anyway, that's it in a nutshell.
If I decide to continue with the car many would advise trying to ascertain the cause of the oil pressure loss and ensuing failure before undertaking yet another build. This makes total sense yet causes me more headaches trying to get this done. So if anyone wants to purchase an incomplete racecar that has a ton of great parts feel free to contact me. I know RHD isn't ideal in most of the Northern Hemisphere but it is what it is.
I feel you Patrick! Been trough similar situations and finally after beating my head bloody of stubborness trying too realize my goals I came to the conclusion of selling my project.
Money wasted you get over but a project that constantly drains ones energy defines ones life during that period.
The wonderful beast of a car you have and the very high class of engineeing gone into it will most likely appeal to someone looking for a really good platform
Money wasted you get over but a project that constantly drains ones energy defines ones life during that period.
The wonderful beast of a car you have and the very high class of engineeing gone into it will most likely appeal to someone looking for a really good platform
Of all the builds I've been following over the years this is the one I wanted to see completed the most. Really sorry to read this. Can’t even imagine your disappointment. Hoping one or more of the vendors step-up and help you make this right.
If you ever make it out to the Washington DC area, beers on me.
If you ever make it out to the Washington DC area, beers on me.