Carpokes

I have a 968 and a spare 3.0L motor. Do you need a car to showcase your work?

cp99 wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2025 11:25 am I have a 968 and a spare 3.0L motor. Do you need a car to showcase your work?

Thanks for asking, I guess it’s a good indicator when I have gotten a bunch of notes like this! We are looking at doing two prototypes right now, one is my original 944 turbo that was the development mule for many engines – it needs to be brought back to great condition because its done a lot of hard work and never complained!
My usual thought on 944s is that they have a good life as street cars and when the get a little older they might get set free as track cars and have a happy retirement. In this case its done both of those and now needs to be reincarnated.
The other prototype is under consideration, depends on what color he likes!

chris white wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2025 12:17 pm

cp99 wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2025 11:25 am I have a 968 and a spare 3.0L motor. Do you need a car to showcase your work?

Thanks for asking, I guess it’s a good indicator when I have gotten a bunch of notes like this! We are looking at doing two prototypes right now, one is my original 944 turbo that was the development mule for many engines – it needs to be brought back to great condition because its done a lot of hard work and never complained!
My usual thought on 944s is that they have a good life as street cars and when the get a little older they might get set free as track cars and have a happy retirement. In this case its done both of those and now needs to be reincarnated.
The other prototype is under consideration, depends on what color he likes!

Keep the thread updated and alive!

chris white wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2025 12:17 pm

cp99 wrote: Thu Feb 06, 2025 11:25 am I have a 968 and a spare 3.0L motor. Do you need a car to showcase your work?

Thanks for asking, I guess it’s a good indicator when I have gotten a bunch of notes like this! We are looking at doing two prototypes right now, one is my original 944 turbo that was the development mule for many engines – it needs to be brought back to great condition because its done a lot of hard work and never complained!
My usual thought on 944s is that they have a good life as street cars and when the get a little older they might get set free as track cars and have a happy retirement. In this case its done both of those and now needs to be reincarnated.
The other prototype is under consideration, depends on what color he likes!

What characteristics will the modern 3.0L turbo have? Minimal lag, free revving, ~7k rpm, 400hp, reliable, good heat management…?

I’d be all over that and I’ll go with electric A/C compressor and power steering pump a la the 996 cup (which is the same pump as some other cars, so you can avoid the p-car tax).

cp99 wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 5:07 am
What characteristics will the modern 3.0L turbo have? Minimal lag, free revving, ~7k rpm, 400hp, reliable, good heat management…?

I’d be all over that and I’ll go with electric A/C compressor and power steering pump a la the 996 cup (which is the same pump as some other cars, so you can avoid the p-car tax).

The 3.0 will be over 500hp (at the crank) using the 8v head. Minimal lag but keeping the 6500 redline. It will rev higher and not blow up but the 8v head gets exponential greater valve guide wear when you rev them up, We are aiming at OEM style life span out of the motor. There will be user adjustable boost so short bursts of high (over 20) will be available.
The A/C compressor and power steering pumps are a good idea but we want to keep things to a price point. That being said we are expecting that there will be some level of customization for each car based on the buyers interest.

I have heard many people ask why Singer/Gunther Werkz, etc haven't come out with a version of the 944 for those with that kind of expendable income. I think it all comes down to the perception of the auto enthusiast population. While many of the "hardcore" 911 enthusiasts often thumb their noses at the transaxle cars, it all comes down to "what can I have that others do not".

Case in point - I'm sure you've seen the PCA video on Youtube called "The Screamer", which is the 89 951 that had over 200K put into it over it's lifetime. I believe it sold on BAT a few years ago for north of $70K. It was essentially a custom 951 restomod that had some work done by Road Scholars, here in Raleigh/Durham. They focus on the Porsche brand and don't just work on any Porsche. The car was fairly local to me (Raleigh, NC) and I actually got to speak with the owner's son at a local car meetup last year (he was in an S2 Cab).

I'm sure a 951 restomod that commands a $100K+ price tag would (or at least SHOULD) compare or outperform a modern Cayman S or Boxter S, but it would need to be both in acceleration and handling. All it needs is the following and will sell:

1) Is it rare/hard to get/very limited production?
2) Is there extreme attention to detail? (Exterior, Interior, Engine Bay, Underside)
3) Does it look/feel/smell like a brand new car? (no squeaks, no interior crayon or gas smell, genuine leather, carbon bits)
4) Has it created buzz? (PCA Magazine, YT Video reviews, SEMA, etc)
5) Does it still have pop up headlights?.........

The problem is, if it DOES sell, that MIGHT then grab the attention of the Singers and Gunther Werkz's of the world and who might start to make their own....and they have big pockets/connections for R&D and custom parts manufacturing.

chris white wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 6:26 am

The 3.0 will be over 500hp (at the crank) using the 8v head. Minimal lag but keeping the 6500 redline. It will rev higher and not blow up but the 8v head gets exponential greater valve guide wear when you rev them up, We are aiming at OEM style life span out of the motor. There will be user adjustable boost so short bursts of high (over 20) will be available.
The A/C compressor and power steering pumps are a good idea but we want to keep things to a price point. That being said we are expecting that there will be some level of customization for each car based on the buyers interest.

Will you be using the 2.7 8v head and 104mm block, I always thought with the big inlet port and valve it was destined for greater things. And conveniently I happen to have those in my parts stash.

NCGermerican wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 8:26 am I have heard many people ask why Singer/Gunther Werkz, etc haven't come out with a version of the 944 for those with that kind of expendable income. I think it all comes down to the perception of the auto enthusiast population. While many of the "hardcore" 911 enthusiasts often thumb their noses at the transaxle cars, it all comes down to "what can I have that others do not".

Case in point - I'm sure you've seen the PCA video on Youtube called "The Screamer", which is the 89 951 that had over 200K put into it over it's lifetime. I believe it sold on BAT a few years ago for north of $70K. It was essentially a custom 951 restomod that had some work done by Road Scholars, here in Raleigh/Durham. They focus on the Porsche brand and don't just work on any Porsche. The car was fairly local to me (Raleigh, NC) and I actually got to speak with the owner's son at a local car meetup last year (he was in an S2 Cab).

I'm sure a 951 restomod that commands a $100K+ price tag would (or at least SHOULD) compare or outperform a modern Cayman S or Boxter S, but it would need to be both in acceleration and handling. All it needs is the following and will sell:

1) Is it rare/hard to get/very limited production?
2) Is there extreme attention to detail? (Exterior, Interior, Engine Bay, Underside)
3) Does it look/feel/smell like a brand new car? (no squeaks, no interior crayon or gas smell, genuine leather, carbon bits)
4) Has it created buzz? (PCA Magazine, YT Video reviews, SEMA, etc)
5) Does it still have pop up headlights?.........

The problem is, if it DOES sell, that MIGHT then grab the attention of the Singers and Gunther Werkz's of the world and who might start to make their own....and they have big pockets/connections for R&D and custom parts manufacturing.

I have a 992 Turbo S and love it, and would still fully embrace a Singer-like 944. Armed with nothing but uninformed arm-chair quarterback skills, I'd say there is a market for a 944 that nails your second and third points even if near Singer's price range; whereas I'm not sure what the market looks like for something less, even if much cheaper.

NCGermerican wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 8:26 am I have heard many people ask why Singer/Gunther Werkz, etc haven't come out with a version of the 944 for those with that kind of expendable income. I think it all comes down to the perception of the auto enthusiast population. While many of the "hardcore" 911 enthusiasts often thumb their noses at the transaxle cars, it all comes down to "what can I have that others do not".

It’s a question of price and purpose. A typical Singer 911 is in the $500k range. Ho doubt he could do one if somebody wanted although he might not want to do anything to tarnish his brand. I believe that a lot of the Singer 911s are being bought as collector cars – not driven frequently and kept on display. That’s not what we are aiming for. We want our cars to be driven as much as possible. Could be a daily driver if you wanted. In PCA like many other places there will always be a group that believes their car or the model they really like but can’t own is the ‘best’ Porsche. The one thing that has kept me attracted to these cars is that they are usable. Drive them, track them, polish them up a show that. All good uses. Beat the shot out of a Singer on the track? OK< maybe Seinfeld could do that….but not many others.

NCGermerican wrote: Fri Feb 07, 2025 8:26 am I'm sure a 951 restomod that commands a $100K+ price tag would (or at least SHOULD) compare or outperform a modern Cayman S or Boxter S, but it would need to be both in acceleration and handling. All it needs is the following and will sell:
1) Is it rare/hard to get/very limited production?
2) Is there extreme attention to detail? (Exterior, Interior, Engine Bay, Underside)
3) Does it look/feel/smell like a brand new car? (no squeaks, no interior crayon or gas smell, genuine leather, carbon bits)
4) Has it created buzz? (PCA Magazine, YT Video reviews, SEMA, etc)
5) Does it still have pop up headlights?.........

The problem is, if it DOES sell, that MIGHT then grab the attention of the Singers and Gunther Werkz's of the world and who might start to make their own....and they have big pockets/connections for R&D and custom parts manufacturing.
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1) Batches of 10 is the goal. Might only be one batch, but if it catches on it will still be very limited production
2) Yes, I am a detail nut in finishes as well as the mechanical parts. I envision that the majority of our buyers will primarily appreciate the finish (exterior and interior) But the platform will deliver a serious upgrade in performance. Much like the typical reaction to owning your first 944 – it’s the looks, touch and feel that attract you. Then you drive it for a while and find out the joy of the 944 platform.
3) Yes, exterior will be dry ice blasted and a windows out paint job. Better than factory….and shut line will be prefect – I hate wonky headlight doors! Interior is being done by the shop that did this (pics below)
4) I believe it will be buzz worthy. I had one of my cars in pano before (still owned by a moderator here!) I’m not the PR guy, but I do know some people!
5) Has to be pop up, its part of the brand! I never liked the fix light w plexi covers. Head lights stay as is with better optics. Looking at revised fog/driving lights. The only major overhaul we are looking at is the rear end. Could be just a euro bumper or a significant restyle…..but tasteful!
And yes ,if will outperform a Boxster or Caymen….maybe not a GT4 but it will hang in there with that too. Power to weight is better, I believe the feel is better and the coilover are adjustable and use spring rates that I have figured out over the last couple of decades. If the customer wants a stiffer or safter ride we can make that adjustment fairly easily.
Base Caymen – 3100lbs and 350hp 8.86 lbs/hp
Ultimate 944 – 3000lbs and 400hp. 7.5 lbs/hp

Wait, you did the Aime Leon Dore 951? I saw that car at the store in SoHo NYC.