Carpokes

dr bob wrote: Sat Mar 08, 2025 5:56 pm


There are some popular beliefs around the Cali standards, like one that the regs tighten every year for older cars. They don't. The tailpipe and equipment standards for any specific U.S. market car are the same now as they were the year the car was first certified for sale. The proposed legislation does nothing to relax those same standards, it only appears to offer a little relief on the testing. Got a modified car? This won't help you much. Got a tired and non-compliant car? Not much relief there at all. They only test the tailpipe and the gas cap too.


[/rant mode]

The text of the bill states "This bill would delete the above partial smog check exemption for collector motor vehicles from existing law. Instead, the bill would fully exempt a collector motor vehicle from the smog check requirement if the vehicle is at least 35 model years old and proof is submitted that the motor vehicle is insured as a collector motor vehicle, as specified."

So, if one could meet the "collector car" insurance requirements per the law, it seems there would be no more smog checks, so run what ya brung! But again, I don't have much faith in this passing given the current climate of CA politics, even though the entire fleet of 35+ year-old cars in CA have a minimal impact on the overall environment. It's all about optics . . . .

I 100% agree about periodic 5-gas analyzer checks of older vehicles, it paints a good picture of what is going on inside the combustion chamber. I compare OBD-I and older customer cars with the O2 sensor connected and disconnected to get an idea of the general state of tune (after checking for vacuum leaks), and generally tune them to be just rich of stoichiometric at idle, they seem to be happier there. Fewer parts per million of HC and higher CO2 percentage=happier engine.

Five-gas analyzer is also great for diagnosing crank but no-start or hard starting conditions, can use the hydrocarbon (HC, or unburnt fuel) reading to great effect.

dr bob wrote: Sat Mar 08, 2025 5:56 pm There are some popular beliefs around the Cali standards, like one that the regs tighten every year for older cars. They don't. The tailpipe and equipment standards for any specific U.S. market car are the same now as they were the year the car was first certified for sale.

This is true. But how those standards are administratively enforced can change, and has done so.

In 1997 I bought a 1981 BMW 323i from a couple in Sacramento. For those of you not familiar with this never-offered-in-USA model, imagine a US-spec 320i with small, chrome bumpers, 4-wheel disc brakes and a 2.3 liter inline six with true dual exhaust. This particular car was privately imported as a new car and federalized by an approved shop (Hardy & Beck) in California. Tested, passed, BAR tag issued and registered in California in late 1981, and passed smog as required every check. But when it went in for testing in '97, the owners were told that despite the tailpipe sniff being compliant, the rest of the emissions equipment was not "what it was supposed to be". They were told that an EGR system would need to be "added". When pressed, the referee station told them that under the updated administrative rules, the only way the owners could expect to pass would be to do a complete engine swap from a compliant US model such as a later 325i. The owners did not find any shops willing to do such a swap, and probably couldn't afford it anyway. So their only viable option was to sell it to an out of state buyer. Me, in this case. It was a great car, especially after I added the Recaro seats, limited slip and 15" staggered BBS/Pirelli combo.

But the point being, while the emissions regs didn't change, how they were implemented did.

Arne2 wrote: Sun Mar 09, 2025 10:57 am
This is true. But how those standards are administratively enforced can change, and has done so.

So true, and true of every law and regulation in the country, from the U.S. Constitution on down.

From the anecdote file: back when they first started smog tests in CA, the smog shops used to shake you down for petty, needless repairs. I once paid $20+ for a wingnut because the hex nut and washer holding down the air filter cover wasn't 'compliant.' When I told the guy I'd put my own wingnut on the car and be back in an hour, he said fine, but I'd have to pay for a new smog test. I assume that was the origin of 'test only' places, and the good news is the pendulum has swung the other way. Since smog tests are their entire business, and word gets out fast on the Internet, they have every incentive in the world not to be picky -- and most aren't these days in my experience.

@Arne2 Thanks for sharing, what a great Euro 323i! One of my all-time favorites. In high school I was on the same swim team as Mr. Beck's son. The son was driving a 2002 Automatic at the time, but no matter how hard I tried, my '91 Volvo 940SE Turbo wagon could not keep up with him on Pinehurst Rd between Moraga and the Oakland hills

@Tom, I've now been around long enough to remember a time when there more shady smog shops out there who had questionable practices like your wing nut experience. I'm happy to report that most of the bad ones here in Santa Barbara were either shut down by the BAR or run out of town.

Much of the "visual" portion of the CA smog check and the finer details of the functional check is left to the discretion of the individual smog tech. For example, if the charcoal canister for the evaporative emission control system is not readily accessible, they often do not fully test the system.

There is a smog shop across the street from my shop that we worked with for years, but they must have gotten heat from the BAR at some point circa 10 years ago, because they suddenly became much more nit-picky about tiny details during the "visual" portion of the inspection. We had a couple of customer mid-'70s 911s with BAR-legal swaps to later 911SC engines that were suddenly called out for minor details like vacuum hose routing, and a VW Rabbit pickup that had a later hood installed---the emissions label was very slightly different than what was on the engine, so they failed it for that after 15+ years of passing it every time.

The smog shop we now work with is much more reasonable, they will call and give us a heads up if they see something they are not comfortable with and allow the opportunity to repair it instead of automatically failing the test.

I hope this bill passes, despite my skepticism, or at least makes it out of committee and onto the floor for a vote!

They amended SB172 yesterday. It's now officially called Leno's Law and, more importantly, they eliminated the requirement to have collector car insurance. I imagine that was due to lobbying by mainstream insurance companies, but also apparently had a disproportionate impact on lower income collectors, since most collector car insurance companies will only ensure cars kept in a garage. The new amendments would exempt all collector cars (used primarily for show) that are 35 model years old or older. Such a cruel tease -- I'm still pretty skeptical that it will ever pass.

https://trackbill.com/bill/california-s ... n/2671682/

I think there's an interpretation gap around "primarily for shows". Could I drive it for anything other than to/from "shows"? How about tours with my local PCA group? Would I have to verify that there's a "show" included in the tour or pleasure drive? There' are several events on the far side of the country I might want to drive to. OK to drive to the edge of the state without a show?

Cali has the interesting benefit of being climate-kind to cars in most of the populated areas of the state. There are plenty of cars that haven't rusted through, that would be OK daily drivers were it not for overzealous 'inspectors'. My memory is that you get only a few 'fails' on a car's inspection record before you are doomed to visiting a 'referee' from that point forward. Referees have no particular interest in passing a referred car, it turns out.

More: Inspectors and referees are at risk if they pass a marginal car, but see no risk if they fail a car when it's actually in compliance. This speaks to the situation that a couple have mentioned about how there seem to be differences in the way the rules are applied.

We'll see how it goes. OBD cars are getting better and better at self-reporting and therefore self-failing emissions inspections. It won't be long before connected cars will need to report their own status to the Sacramento Mothership before registration is renewed.

Folks who have to pass MOT or TUV probably laugh at 'inspections' that Cali performs.

dr bob wrote: Tue Mar 25, 2025 12:51 pm

Folks who have to pass MOT or TUV probably laugh at 'inspections' that Cali performs.

and sometimes just swear at the complete lack of standards for headlight position adjustment.

There are standards written in several places, but no enforcement mechanism, even for new-delivery cars.

I sold my absolutely stunningly restored 912E (Light Yellow over black leather, sunroof, Fuchs....) because it was near impossible to keep it smog complaint here in California. It's a 1976 model, so JUST missed the 1975 exemption limit. I was very sad to part with it, but, I couldn't drive it without it passing smog.... It now lives in Florida, and, well, I have moved on to a 996. Anyway, I hope sanity prevails with regard to fixing the draconian smog requirements here....but. Perhaps we could hire Bilbo Baggins, to deal with Smog....he gets the job DONE. !!!!!!

dr bob wrote: Tue Mar 25, 2025 12:51 pm I think there's an interpretation gap around "primarily for shows". Could I drive it for anything other than to/from "shows"? How about tours with my local PCA group? Would I have to verify that there's a "show" included in the tour or pleasure drive? There' are several events on the far side of the country I might want to drive to. OK to drive to the edge of the state without a show?

Oregon's collector car restrictions are a little easier to interpret. It boils down to not driving the collector car for normal day-to-day uses. No commuting, or daily errands. But most any recreational use is OK, even just a weekend drive to a picnic spot. Basically just don't get caught driving to work in it.