Carpokes

My water temp gets up to 194F pretty quickly and stays there. My oil temp takes much longer to get up to temp, usually over 210F, but tends to fluctuate based on outside temps and how I'm driving. I generally wait for the oil to get up to at least 200 or so before I consider the car fully warmed up (i.e., warm enough to floor it to redline). Curious if others wait for any particular temps before considering the car fully warmed up?

Tom wrote: Mon Dec 19, 2022 5:30 pm My water temp gets up to 194F pretty quickly and stays there. My oil temp takes much longer to get up to temp, usually over 210F, but tends to fluctuate based on outside temps and how I'm driving. I generally wait for the oil to get up to at least 200 or so before I consider the car fully warmed up (i.e., warm enough to floor it to redline). Curious if others wait for any particular temps before considering the car fully warmed up?

Tom, regarding your question specifically, I personally don't usually pay attention to a specific oil or coolant temp range for proper warm ups. I feel it's far less critical with modern engines and their close tolerances, along with the incredible synthetics that keep everything lubricated so much better than oil from back in the day. Synthetics get spread to surfaces in a few strokes.

For me it's sufficient to use common sense restraint after ignition and during the first few miles driven (more if it's colder). Even on track I think a few minutes idling in paddock followed by a warm-up out-lap or two is fine.

However, I do think it's key to work up steadily and a little conservatively to any kind of aggressive driving, especially hard, redline-approaching acceleration.

Water / coolant/ antifreeze heats up quicker due to the thermostat preventing circulation below its set point. Oil is always circulating to lubricate and cool the internal parts of the engine, so it takes longer to achieve a steady state.

Modern oils are major leaps ahead of good ol’ 10-30, but the enemy of any mechanical system is heat, or in my mechanical engineering opinion, unbalanced heat. So, I take it easy for the first few minutes of driving. Luckily, my BMW doesn’t have an oil temperature gauge to compare. I have a full throttle, 0-70 merge about 15 minutes from my house, and I figure once I get there, full acceleration is ok.

I've followed Jake Raby's advice: Keep the revs below 3000 until the oil temp reaches 200. He's the owner of Flar 6 Innovations, BTW, and knows a little about Porsche engines. Usually 6-8 minutes of driving time will reach that level unless it's really cold, in which case you probably shouldn't be driving a sports car with high performance tires anyway. So, Tom, you're right on track.

For me, with modern engines and oils it doesn’t take long, perhaps just a few minutes for all in the engine to warm up to normal temp and for the appropriate thermostats to start opening for cooling to take place and from then = stability.

For daily driving I think get in, start up, drive normal and enjoy,
however if we’re talking about thrashing at eg 70mph or higher on motorway or tracking, I would think much more needs to be hotter, eg shocks, tyres etc , quite a different approach and preparation to daily driving.

grasmere wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 6:44 am For me, with modern engines and oils it doesn’t take long, perhaps just a few minutes for all in the engine to warm up to normal temp and for the appropriate thermostats to start opening for cooling to take place and from then = stability.

For daily driving I think get in, start up, drive normal and enjoy,
however if we’re talking about thrashing at eg 70mph or higher on motorway or tracking, I would think much more needs to be hotter, eg shocks, tyres etc , quite a different approach and preparation to daily driving.

For "normal" cars, this is OK, but Porsche's aren't "normal." And keep in mind water temp isn't the same as oil temp. The oil takes much longer to get up to normal operating temperature than the coolant does, as has been stated and explained in this thread. The oil is basically the lifeblood of the engine, and while you may get away with flooring it once the water temp is 200, the better choice is to wait until the oil temp reaches that level as well. This is for long-term engine viability, if you plan to trade it in a year or two you likely won't see any negative results, but some owner down the road might.

By waiting until the oil temp reaches 200 degrees all the moving parts in the engine will have reached their optimal operating temperatures, and things will just work better and more smoothly, IMO. But you are right, it only takes a few minutes, 6-8 as I stated in my previous post. I live 1/2 mile from an interstate exit and I normally take that route into town for my errands, shopping, etc. This allows me to run the car at 3000 rpm (about 81 mph) for from two to six miles(depending on which exit I take), and that usually brings the oil temp up to close to 200 if not a bit over. Once there, I can accelerate more enthusiastically as we all like to drive our Porsches.

And 3000 rpm is pretty low if you take notice, my normal shift point is closer to 4000 rpm, so I try to keep a close eye on the tach until the magic 200 degrees is reached.

This thread is a little like the "which oil is best?" discussion, many opinions, no one is right for all situations, but I trust Jake Raby explicitly and I've chosen to take his advice.
YMMV.

Another consideration to the "what's best" question is the age of the vehicle. There is a big difference in a current, modern engine vs that of one from, say, the 60s that not only had different manufacturing techniques and materials but also now has age to take into account.

I go back to using restraint and common sense, coupled with awareness of what one's driving and all relevant conditions and situations.

Referring to current gen vehicles and Porsche in particular, this is the exact quote from my '22 911 TTS owner's manual on page 126 under the "Starting the engine" section:

"Do not warm up the engine when stationary. Drive off immediately. Avoid high engine speeds and full throttle until the engine has reached operating temperature."


This would not apply to older vehicles which takes me full circle back to having an awareness of what one's driving and always using good judgement.

When I turn my car on, I always leave it running until the oil temp is about 126deg, that is when the oil temp start to show a bar. Then I change to Sport and that is when I go. I will still do not over rev the engine until it has time for the oil to get up to temp. Old habit I know. I was told that it is not the temp of the water, but the oil temp that matters when driving a car.

Eric

blueline wrote: Tue Dec 20, 2022 7:24 am Referring to current gen vehicles and Porsche in particular, this is the exact quote from my '22 911 TTS owner's manual on page 126 under the "Starting the engine" section:

"Do not warm up the engine when stationary. Drive off immediately. Avoid high engine speeds and full throttle until the engine has reached operating temperature."


This would not apply to older vehicles which takes me full circle back to having an awareness of what one's driving and always using good judgement.

That quote is what prompted me to ask. I guess it's intentionally vague since there are too many variables to specify in an owner's handbook -- maybe to your point of just being mindful and sensible during warm-up.

I ask because I make a frequent trip to see my elderly parents, who live about 10 miles away. The oil doesn't get to 200+ until I'm near at their house (maybe 8 or 9 miles of driving). Being a neurotic, the drive over tends to be less fun than the drive home... So just curious how my neuroses compared to others...

Just like water temp isn't a great proxy for engine temps, since it heats up so much faster than everything else, I assume oil gets to its full temp before all the metal bits in the engine have expanded to their full operating temp tolerances. So is 8 or 9 miles even enough? These are the things that keep me up at night.

Incidentally, I assume my car has an oil thermostat to block off the oil cooler as it warms up (just like the coolant thermostat). I can't remember the exact temp, but suspect the oil thermostat opens in somewhere in the 180F's. I say this because it always gets up to that temp, then hangs at that temp for a while, and then starts climbing again. My suspicion is the oil thermostat is opening in that range, which slows the heating process (after dumping unheated oil from the cooler into the motor). So maybe Porsche thinks mid-180F oil is fully warmed up?