Looking for DME BIN files

[Tom]

You guys are awesome! Thanks for that info. For whatever reason, I just tried that on my car and the idle didn't budge. I scanned the BIN and that was the only location I could find (0x5F9 to 0x600) with that exact string of numbers. I bumped all three up to 18, then 20, and got no change to the idle at all. (I 'commit change' in the hex editor, then 'upload bin to hardware' to get it in the Ostrich, which seems to work for other edits.) Wondering if APE did something else in their file that overrides some other constraint. There is also apparently a Euro BIN with and without O2 closed loop, and logic paths that change within both the Euro and North American BINs based on the country code, so quite a few variables I guess. If you can control idle with map edits on a 24-pin chip, however, that would seem to say the idle RPM is not hard-coded into the ROM (or lower half of the 8k chips). Do you know if you have the country code plug shorted in your car @Dave W. ?

[johnb]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what binary image are you starting with? Are you taking a stock bin file and editing the rpm table, or editing the one from your car which I presume is heavily modded?

[Dave W.]

The work will be tedious and time consuming, but the way I did it was by searching for every instance of '13' in the code, then looking at the number following the '13'. If the next number was 02, 03, 04, 05, or 06 then it was most likely a coolant temp based table. I found 20 tables with this method. There are several instances where 13 was followed by a high number, which is some other code that I wasn't interested in.

FYI the other tables I found that use coolant temp are startup enrichment, startup ignition timing adjustment, ECT running enrichment, ECT timing adjustment, Accell enrichment, ISV base values and more.

Tom, do you know how to use the map tracer function in TunerPro/Ostrich? It's useful for finding tables that are currently in use.

[Dave W.]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what binary image are you starting with? Are you taking a stock bin file and editing the rpm table, or editing the one from your car which I presume is heavily modded?

My code base is an APE 24 pin chip. They use their own compiler, so everything is in a different location, although many of the maps are identical to stock, which makes it easier to find using a string search.

[johnb]

There is another NTC-dependent map of rpm values that's used as an alternative to the one Dave W. used, but I don't know what controls it:

Screenshot_2025-09-03_15-33-09.png (60.66 KiB) Viewed 429 times

The values are all set to 14 (800rpm)


There's a flag 23h.3 that determines which of these 2 maps get used, but I don't know what that flag represents:

Screenshot_2025-09-03_15-33-50.png (64.17 KiB) Viewed 429 times

Tom maybe your car is using this one and the extra 40 you're seeing is being added by some other process.

EDIT...I think the mystery flag 23h.3 is altitude related but I'm not sure.

[Tom]

Sorry if this is a stupid question, but what binary image are you starting with? Are you taking a stock bin file and editing the rpm table, or editing the one from your car which I presume is heavily modded?

My code base is an APE 24 pin chip. They use their own compiler, so everything is in a different location, although many of the maps are identical to stock, which makes it easier to find using a string search.

I took a 24-pin APE BIN and copied it into the upper 8k of a stock 28-pin BIN just now. Car fired right up, but changing that idle map still didn't do anything. I'll try the map before it with the 14's next...

[Tom]

Success!! You guys are awesome. Thank you, thank you! The string of four 14's starting at 0x5F5 did the trick! I was able to take the idle up to whatever I wanted by increasing those 14's. I'll try changing it with temps too once the engine cools down, and suspect that'll work too. I'm doing my own XDF and will post it here on CP when done, so this will be a great addition! Seriously appreciate the assist, and for what it's worth, you guys are way smarter than ChatGPT.

Now back to finding a test car john's KLR chip.

[johnb]

Success!! You guys are awesome. Thank you, thank you! The string of four 14's starting at 0x5F5 did the trick! I was able to take the idle up to whatever I wanted by increasing those 14's. I'll try changing it with temps too once the engine cools down, and suspect that'll work too. I'm doing my own XDF and will post it here on CP when done, so this will be a great addition! Seriously appreciate the assist, and for what it's worth, you guys are way smarter than ChatGPT.

Now back to finding a test car john's KLR chip.

That's interesting...does you car still have the altimeter? Maybe yours is the normal one and Dave W is at high altitude?

[Tom]

Success!! You guys are awesome. Thank you, thank you! The string of four 14's starting at 0x5F5 did the trick! I was able to take the idle up to whatever I wanted by increasing those 14's. I'll try changing it with temps too once the engine cools down, and suspect that'll work too. I'm doing my own XDF and will post it here on CP when done, so this will be a great addition! Seriously appreciate the assist, and for what it's worth, you guys are way smarter than ChatGPT.

Now back to finding a test car john's KLR chip.

That's interesting...does you car still have the altimeter? Maybe yours is the normal one and Dave W is at high altitude?

Yes, I still have the altitude switch in my car, which sends a ground signal to the DME pin 30 over a certain altitude. So even if Dave tossed his out, both our DME's should be seeing the same thing on pin 30 (nothing) unless he's recently moved to the high country. (I'll test mine just in case its grounding in error, but seems like a long shot).

I can't think why Dave's idle moved based on that 3-cell map, and mine didn't. If APR somehow pointed idle to that map, why didn't it work when I put the APE map in the upper half of an 8k chip? Different APE 24-pin image? Different programming code in the internal 8051 ROM vs the 8k chip?

It does occur to me that Josh/Rogue was based in Denver if memory serves, so I'm suddenly wondering (and will check) if his idle maps work when the altitude switch is triggered...?

[Dave W.]

Success!! You guys are awesome. Thank you, thank you! The string of four 14's starting at 0x5F5 did the trick! I was able to take the idle up to whatever I wanted by increasing those 14's. I'll try changing it with temps too once the engine cools down, and suspect that'll work too. I'm doing my own XDF and will post it here on CP when done, so this will be a great addition! Seriously appreciate the assist, and for what it's worth, you guys are way smarter than ChatGPT.

Now back to finding a test car john's KLR chip.

That's interesting...does you car still have the altimeter? Maybe yours is the normal one and Dave W is at high altitude?

I think I'm closer to sea level than Tom. It's possible APE changed their code to save space?
From my notes, the altitude on/off switch is stored at memory address 14.
RPM is 37
Load is 49
air temp is 12
coolant temp is 13
battery volts -11
AFM Delta -03
TPS - 16
FQS - 17

I just realized that if anyone is going to raise their idle RPM significantly, they might need to also raise the idle fuel cutoff RPM so it doesn't cut fuel if the rpm surges a little. FR Wilk also liked to raise this section to reduce the bucking/surging sensation when decelerating in gear. There's no hysteresis in the code, so the engine can instantly cut or restore fuel/idle mode with no delay when the RPM crosses this point, leading to a rapid on/off jerkiness. I raised the values by 80 rpm and noticed an improvement. IIRC FR Wilk used a much higher RPM around 1700.
Here's the header info for my APE chip;
13 05 * 6C 19 1F 1D 31 followed by 5 rpm values. The RPM conversion is still the same, just multiply by 40. The coolant temps convert to: -23 106 136 174 208

EDIT- oh dam, I just realized this is already in the stock XDF listed as 'Low RPM Limit for Coasting: coolant based'.